Sleep on It: Why Perfect Sleep Isn't the Goal

ahunterarnold

Oct 22

4 min read

Episode overview

How much sleep do women runners actually need? And what happens when getting enough of it feels completely out of our control?

Ashley hasn't slept through the night in more than two years, thanks to two young kids. Trax is navigating early-morning wakeups, night sweats and the sleep disruptions that come with perimenopause. Both are still running, training and chasing goals, but they're also wondering whether they're getting enough sleep to recover or have simply gotten used to being tired.

In this episode, Ashley and Trax talk with sleep specialist Dr. Shelby Harris about why women's sleep changes with age, what to do when you can't fall back asleep and how the pressure to achieve perfect sleep can actually make things worse. They explore the limitations of sleep trackers, the importance of consistent routines and when persistent sleep problems deserve medical attention.

Two-time Olympian Molly Huddle shares the realities of raising two young children while continuing to train and race. She explains why she's accepted that her running performance may suffer during this stage of motherhood, how she adjusts workouts when she's exhausted and why she's choosing to keep showing up even when she's not as prepared as she'd like to be.

Finally, professional mountain runner Grayson Murphy shares what happened when her once-essential nine hours of sleep collided with new motherhood. She describes the impact of sleep deprivation on her training, the improvements she noticed when her daughter's sleep got better and why she's shifted her focus from how much she can train to how much she can recover from.

The takeaway: Sleep matters, but perfect sleep isn't always possible. Understanding what your body needs, recognizing when to seek help and adjusting your expectations may be more useful than chasing another perfect sleep score.

In this conversation

Why hormonal changes during menstruation, pregnancy, postpartum, perimenopause and menopause can affect women's sleep.
Why sleep quality and depth change as we age, even though our overall need for sleep remains relatively consistent.
What to do when you wake up in the middle of the night and can't fall back asleep.
Why trying harder to sleep can actually make insomnia worse.
How chronic sleep deprivation can affect performance and judgment, even when you think you're functioning just fine.
Why anxiety about poor sleep and its long-term health consequences may create additional sleep problems.
How sleep consistency, caffeine consumption and everyday habits affect sleep quality.
Why consumer sleep trackers aren't always accurate, particularly when measuring individual sleep stages.
Whether runners should push through a hard workout after a bad night's sleep or adjust their training.
Why persistent fatigue, sleep apnea and restless legs syndrome deserve attention, particularly in women.
When treatments such as cognitive behavioral therapy for insomnia, hormone therapy or medical evaluation may help.
Molly Huddle on why she's choosing to prioritize motherhood even when it means compromising her training and recovery.
How Molly continues racing on approximately 40 miles per week and why showing up still brings her joy.
How sharing nighttime responsibilities and protecting uninterrupted blocks of sleep can help parents manage fatigue.
Why Molly often starts a workout after a difficult night but adjusts the pace or duration based on how she's feeling.
Grayson Murphy on the effects of postpartum sleep deprivation, including changes in heart rate, workout quality and mental readiness.
Why Grayson now approaches training by asking what she can recover from rather than how much she can run.
How adequate fueling becomes especially important when balancing breastfeeding, training and less-than-ideal sleep.
Why one bad night of sleep, even before a race, doesn't necessarily mean a poor performance.
How to accept the realities of different life stages without ignoring genuine sleep problems or giving up on running goals.

Meet the guests

Dr. Shelby Harris, PsyD, DBSM, is a board-certified clinical psychologist specializing in behavioral sleep medicine. She is the author of The Women's Guide to Overcoming Insomnia and The Essential Guide to Children's Sleep. Her work focuses on helping people understand and treat sleep problems using evidence-based approaches. She is also a mother, classically trained double bassist and marathon runner who has completed 27 marathons.

Molly Huddle is a two-time Olympian, multiple American record holder and one of the most accomplished distance runners in U.S. history. A longtime professional runner and mother of two young daughters, Molly continues to train and compete while navigating the changing demands of motherhood, childcare and recovery.

Grayson Murphy is a two-time World Mountain Running Champion, multiple-time national champion and professional runner who competes across track, road and mountain running. A new mother to daughter Violet, Grayson is navigating her return to high-level training while adjusting to the physical and mental demands of postpartum recovery.